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  5. A real mystery, no one can figure out why we are not able to charge from the alternators anymore.

A real mystery, no one can figure out why we are not able to charge from the alternators anymore.

  • J

    We have a Victron/Rec BMS/Wakespeed system that was set up for solar charging but just now hooked up 6 solar panels (2500 watts). The alternator charging system worked fine before the solar panels were connected (REC-BMS + WS500), but we aren’t getting any charge from the alternators now, even when we switch off the solar panels at their 48v circuit breakers. We are getting a charge from the solar panels when the sun shines.  System details: Rec Active BMS w/ WS500 & Victron GX support, two Victron Smart Solar Charge Controllers (MPPT 150/100-Tr VE.can), two Victron Lynx distributors (1000 DC), two Wakespeed WS500 for 2 alternators, two Victron Quattro inverter/chargers, and 12-v lithium house battery pack (7x4 cells). Any suggestions? What can we test?

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  • B

    Can you post a logfile from the ws500 when the engeines are running.

    Logfile can be made with Laptop and program Putty, see wakespeed manual.

    Or with a phone and the WS500 app, see wakespeed website, on how todo.

    The logfile contains plenty off info to troubel shoot.

     

    You could also test with the datacables from ws500, disconnected, And see or thsi made any differene.

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  • B

    Are your WS500 connected to the Cerbo?   If so, you could also share your VRM, maybe this shows what the problem is.  This in combination with the logfiles gives loads off info.

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  • J

    Ben, many thanks.  We recorded the WS500 log during two startup scenarios:  1) with solar connected and 2) with solar circuit breakers off.  I don't know how to send the full log files, but below are some snippets from after startup.  The Cerbo gave WS500 error messages 44 (scenario 1) and 13 (scenario 2). Flashing lights gave the same messages.

    Jay

    Scenario 1:

    FLT;,44,0
    AST;,0.11, ,14.35,-0.1,-0.1,-1, ,14.40,373,15000,2, ,21,21, ,0, ,14.35,20,-99,0
    CPE;,8,13.20,0,0,0, ,0,0,0.00,0, ,13.20,0,0,0,0,0.00, ,0,0.00,0, ,0.00,0,0,0, ,0.000,0,2,50,  ,0.00,5,40,25,0, ,0, ,0.00
    NPC;,0,WS500-REC,1234, ,1073992124
    CST;,1,0,2,70, ,1,1, ,1,0,1, ,0,0,3, ,129, ,0,0,0
    SST;,AREG2.4.3, ,0,0, ,8,2.00,1.00, ,0,0, ,5,71, ,0
    SCV;,0,0,0,0.00,0.00,8, ,100,1.00,0.75,0.50,0, ,0,0, ,12,2.830,10000, ,0,0,30,0,0.00,0,0,0,0, ,0
    AOK;
    FLT;,44,0
    AST;,0.11, ,14.39,0.0,0.0,0, ,14.40,373,15000,2, ,21,21, ,0, ,14.39,20,-99,0
    CPE;,8,13.20,0,0,0, ,0,0,0.00,0, ,13.20,0,0,0,0,0.00, ,0,0.00,0, ,0.00,0,0,0, ,0.000,0,2,50,  ,0.00,5,40,25,0, ,0, ,0.00
    NPC;,0,WS500-REC,1234, ,1073992124
    CST;,1,0,2,70, ,1,1, ,1,0,1, ,0,0,3, ,129, ,0,0,0
    SST;,AREG2.4.3, ,0,0, ,8,2.00,1.00, ,0,0, ,5,71, ,0
    SCV;,0,0,0,0.00,0.00,8, ,100,1.00,0.75,0.50,0, ,0,0, ,12,2.830,10000, ,0,0,30,0,0.00,0,0,0,0, ,0
    AOK;

    Scenario 2:

    FLT;,13,0
    AST;,0.05, ,14.37,0.1,0.1,1, ,14.40,373,15000,2, ,21,21, ,0, ,14.37,20,-99,0
    CPE;,8,13.20,0,0,0, ,0,0,0.00,0, ,13.20,0,0,0,0,0.00, ,0,0.00,0, ,0.00,0,0,0, ,0.000,0,2,50,  ,0.00,5,40,25,0, ,0, ,0.00
    NPC;,0,WS500-REC,1234, ,1073992124
    CST;,1,0,2,70, ,1,1, ,1,0,1, ,0,0,3, ,129, ,0,0,0
    SST;,AREG2.4.3, ,0,0, ,8,2.00,1.00, ,0,0, ,-4,-62, ,0
    SCV;,0,0,0,0.00,0.00,8, ,100,1.00,0.75,0.50,0, ,0,0, ,12,2.830,10000, ,0,0,30,0,0.00,0,0,0,0, ,0
    AOK;
    FLT;,13,0
    AST;,0.05, ,14.40,-0.0,-0.0,0, ,14.40,373,15000,2, ,21,21, ,0, ,14.40,20,-99,0
    CPE;,8,13.20,0,0,0, ,0,0,0.00,0, ,13.20,0,0,0,0,0.00, ,0,0.00,0, ,0.00,0,0,0, ,0.000,0,2,50,  ,0.00,5,40,25,0, ,0, ,0.00
    NPC;,0,WS500-REC,1234, ,1073992124
    CST;,1,0,2,70, ,1,1, ,1,0,1, ,0,0,3, ,129, ,0,0,0
    SST;,AREG2.4.3, ,0,0, ,8,2.00,1.00, ,0,0, ,-4,-62, ,0
    SCV;,0,0,0,0.00,0.00,8, ,100,1.00,0.75,0.50,0, ,0,0, ,12,2.830,10000, ,0,0,30,0,0.00,0,0,0,0, ,0
    AOK;

     

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  • J

    Quick update, when the engines are started up without the USB connection to the WS500, there are no error codes (flashing amber for "slave" mode).  Jay

     

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  • B

    @Jay

    Explanation:
    If you connect the usb, the regulator starts up as normal, same way as you apply power to the brown wire.
    This can explain the difference in behaviour you see, when you plug in the usb cable at a different moment.
    Profit from this, when you do programming, you dont need to power the brown wire.

    But to log a practical situation, it is better to plug in the usb, after the WS500 is started up from power by the brown wire.

    You mention: ""The WS500 was working before the solar was installed""
    Yes this could be, profile 8 is programmed to charge max 13.2V (at 12V nominal).
    If your batteries were low, you will have seen charge before, that's correct.
    But now the voltage is 14.4V, you will not see any charge.
    You need to discharge the batteries to see any charge!! (and solve the error problem, see below)


    A few things:
    To read the log file yourself see full manual:
    https://www.wakespeed.com/wp-content/uploads/Wakespeed-Communications-and-Configuration-Guide-v2.5.0-09.26.2022.pdf
    OR read:
    https://www.wakespeed.com/wp-content/uploads/Wakespeed-Utility-Configuration-Guide-V3-09.30.2022.pdf

    I see also:
    you run an older firmware version.
    Best to update.

    Profile 8 is programmed as "fallback mode", If bms dont send a "target voltage", the regulator goes to max 13.2V.
    You could choose to program this with a full lifepo4 profile. (max voltage to max 13.8 as example) but with float settings etc.
    If there is a CAN or BMS problem, you can remove the CAN connections from the WS500, and the regulator will start up as a standalone controller, not as a controller guided by the BMS.
    For troubleshooting this can also be helpful.
    Just a tip,  back to your problem.

    In normal working mode, with the RECbms correctly connected by CAN, you should see value 39, in AST line, first value after 15000
    Did you have seen in earlier report value 39?  If so, this means your CAN cables are correctly installed
    If not, maybe you have seen charging amps before, because battery was below 13.2V.
     

    In posted reports I see value 2, means in error.
    That's why you dont see any charge. (AND because your battery is FULL)

    Why this error?:
    Can you check or the fuse in wire alt+ wire 6 is ok?

    Can you check or the fuse in Voltsense wire 11 is ok?

    What is the voltage at both points?


    Can you post pictures and diagram/drawing, where cables 5 and 6 and 10 and 11 are connected

    Are there any charge discontactors between alternator and batteries, please show them in the system diagram.

    Are there any main switches in the system positive and negative, please show them in your diagram.

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  • J

    Ben, many thanks. That sounds like a good explanation. We will deplete the house batteries to below 13.2v tomorrow when we are at dock and then test the alternator charging.

    I am correct in assuming that "7" is the correct profile for LiFePO4 batteries? [our DIP settings are correct for LiFePO4, but they seem to be over-ridden].

    Jay

     

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  • B

    Your dipswitches are override at the moment, or by programming, OR after using the ws500 app. 

    It is set in your logfiles, as override, at profile 8.

    Profile 7 and 8 are both custom programmable.

    In your log file, the first value after CPE, is the profile the regulator is using.

    I dont know the factory setting from profile 7, Or how your dealer programmed it.  

    Dont forget to check the fuse in cable 6 , and be sure there is a fuse installed.

    Pictures is also hlpfull.

    Make a diagram and post it.  

    Make logfiles from your testing.

    Do you see both alternators on the Cerbo and also the REC bms?

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  • J

    Closing the loop on this thread .... many thanks Ben.  The problem was finally diagnosed by a tech in Maryland.  When the solar power system was installed, the the WS500 was reconnected to the wrong place.  It was not seeing the true battery voltage and was therefore not responding correctly. I was no longer on the vessel so I cannot tell you how it was connected, but my brother reports that the problem has been resolved without replacing either the WS500 or the REC-BMS. Jay

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