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No matter how I adjust the various settings in my custom profile I cannot keep my alternators at Acceptance level voltage long enough. The WS500s drop to Float at about 96% and 20A in. With my Firefly batteries I am looking to see 6A (@ 24V). I attached a series of screen shots of my profile settings.
When on shore power, the chargers have no problem achieving these targets.
Thanks
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Nice that you post all your settings. Looking at your uploaded files at 29 august.
I see Battery Bat cap ovrd at 3.6
This means that the 3 amp (accept amp exit) under bulk , multiply 3,6 is 10.8 amp.
Conclusion, IF amps comes below 10.8amp, the regulator goes to the next step.
If you like 6 amp exit to next charge profile, you have programmed the wrong parameters.
How big is your battery bank, how many ampH?
As example:
If you bank is 500ampH is 1800amph/24V program 3.6 for \"\"Bat cap ovrd\"\"
If your bank is 900ampH/24V program 1.8 \"\"Bat cap ovrd\"\"
If you like \"to switch to next charge stage\" at 1% from a bank with 900ampH, this is at 9amp reading on your shunt.
You program 9 /1.8= 5amp for \"\"accept amp exit\"\"
You mention \"drop to Float at about 96%\", Where did you read this 96%?
What are the settings from this device.
Often I see that the SOC reading is not 100% correctly, sometimes because wrong setting in the battery monitor.
A few more things:
:there is a presetting in the ws500 for firefly batteries, You can use profile 6 instead off profile 7
:I see overcharge programmed, with same voltage as accept charge fase, I dont see the logic from this
: You use a older firmware not the newest 2.5
Try to update your firmware, and play with settings. And read the manual about overcharge.
Ben
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Ben, Much appreciate the detailed response. Here is where I am:
- just updated firmware to latest rev
- I will deactivate Overcharge altogether. I had to read up on Finish Charge to understand. Dont think I need that anyway.
- Bank is 900Ahrs@24V. I was doing every calc in 12v nominal, so if 500Ahrs is in 12V, figure I needed to convert my bank to 12v so 1800Ahrs. so that got me the 3.6 ratio. Not sure about the math if we use 500 (12V) and 900 (24V) in the same equation. 5*1.8=9 gets me back to about where I was at 3*3.6=10.8
- I am using 3A for Exit now, so changing to 5A wont help the issue of dropping to float too soon. However, changing the battery multiplier to 1.8 as you say would get me close to 6. If I am at 10.8A (3*3.6) I am still drop to Float at 15-20A...
- I get my SOC from my Mastervolt remote panel, reading from a MS shunt. I figure its pretty accurate as I can also read Ahrs consumed and current in and all three numbers are in line. Yesterday I approached the dock at 96% with 17A current to batteries. After plugging in to shore power, I picked up SOC at 96% and 16A it took the chargers anther 3hrs to hit the tail current of 6A.
- I will go make the mods. A bit of a challenge to test in the real world, multiple hrs run time to watch the transitions
any other thoughts most welcome. Thanks
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point 3:
There is not written in the manual todo any calculation to a 12V/500Ah Battery, I dont know from where you had this info.
In de manual from Wakespeed is written:
\"Which Battery Capacity Multiplier entry should be used against normalized 500Ah battery? \"
I see that the software from Offgrid solution, could give you the wrong understanding.
To, Rick, maybe better remove the word battery, in the top line from CPE settings!!
point 4:
Changing Multiplier ampH capacity, and Exit amps will make effect.
Just follow the manual.
point 5:
I understand that with 17amp, the regulator was still in Accept charge. Looks ok for me.
It was better for the test to keep the engine running a bit longer, to see at which amps the regulator went to float.
Suggestion to repeat this test.. Or keep a eye on it in a later state.
I have installed this regulator installed on our own boat for more as 5 years, I monitor very closely multiply times, I never have see any problem with exit amps.
Some other notes:
How long is your cable to the shunt?
Did you extend the original harness or did you use the long original harness?
Did you use twisted pair for the cable to the shunt?
If cable to the shunt is long, You need to used twisted pair, and maybe shielded wire!!.
Connect the shield on one side to negative.
Shielded wire is needed, especially if the shunt is in the same conduct with other high amp or higher voltage cables.
regards, Ben
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Thanks Ben,
- Bat Cap Multiplier. Lots of places in the WS manuals where it says system is designed around a normalized 12v system. I was over-applying that logic and assuming the A were normalized as the V were. Thinking, \"if V is 12V, then A is 12v so both need to be factored...\"but I recognize that is a mistake. I fixed that in my updated custom profile.
- Fuel is expensive! running from 17A to >6A each time I want to test a setting is hours of run time. So I am testing when I can. I can bring the batteries down 5% in the slip and then run them back up w the engines to test.
- I dont have any way to remotely watch the WS from the pilot house in real time. I can log. I will try.
- I need to set up a CAN based remote display in the pilot house. Will do that but will take some time
- You raise a good point with all this: I am reading tail current from my Mastervolt shunt and am confident it is accurate. But that doesnt mean the WS are sensing the same tail current. Different shunt, different location, etc. I will need to find a way to read the tail current that the WS is seeing.
- . ANy progress at WS for a wireless remote display capability?
- Thanks, Greg
Thanks
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I belive the Mastervolt Mastershunt 500 is 300A/50mv.
You would think its 500A/50mv, but its not.
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Thanks,
I am reading tail current from Mastervolt closed loop network on the Mastervolt remote display so I am assuming the battery current I am reading is correct, although I have never measured it directly. A bit of a second order confirmation of its accuracy; when I turn on my 100A charger I see the 100A (+/-) coming in.
Meanwhile, I installed a dedicated shunt for the WS.
To get into the weeds a bit deeper, I have two physical battery banks, tied to a common bus. Both banks are 24V. There is a Mastervolt shunt close to each physical bank, one Master and one slave. The WS shunt is at the common bus. It feeds two WS500\'s for my twin JD\'s.
Just now I have been disconnected from shore power for a while and will crank up and compare current readings at both of the WS500s and also at the MS shunt and see if there is any disparity. I can read WS500 A using the OffGrid sw tool. Ben\'s comments got me thinking that I may be reading erroneous data at the WS500s. More to follow.
Please stay tuned.
Thanks,Greg
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Understood. I thought maybe you used the Mastershunt as an shunt for the WS500.
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would have been sweet to use the same shunt but the MS shunt converts to a digital message and no way to get at the shunt itself.
Thanks
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You can connect an Masterbus shunt to an WS500 if you want.
Shunt is between negative input and output in the Mastervolt shunt.
Just connecto the WS500 shunt terminals to these two posts and setup the correct settings.
I used the Mastervolt shunt as an shunt for my REC A-BMS for 5 years before switching to an 500A shunt, as I now have 400A+ charging power..
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Yep, I probably asked the MS tech the wrong question. The MS CAN bus output is digital but I could have wired directly. Just checked the current measured by the WS and it agrees with the MS shunt. So however I managed to get here, the amp reading at the WS is correct. Meanwhile, the WS exits ACC too soon. My guess is, I still have a setting incorrect.
If anyone has time on their hands, I attached my logged data. This is w engines off. I will bring the batteries down overnight and run the engines in the AM and log more data. Battery capacity is 900Ahrs @24V. Tail current target (Firefly) is 6A. Temp comp is .024mv@12V.
Thanks, Greg
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your blog 2 september:
1. read as normalized 12V and read as normalized 500ampH
2. There is no reason to discharge the batteries to test exit amps.
I f battery is full, normal behavior will be, start with high amp flow when start the alternator.
When battery is full it goes very quick to a lower amp flow, this means it reach very quick the \"\"exit amp\"\"
This means a much shorter test. (lesser fuel :):)
3.4.5. If you have a battery monitor nothing else is needed, is my view. With battery monitor you see amps comes in, You see or alternator is charging. After installation, monitor the setup, amp, exit amps, temperature. If all is good, forget about.
Enjoy cruising, sailing, instead off monitoring devices :):)
6. Ask Wakespeed.
About you logfile.
Looks like your amp shunt is not connected. No reading.
OR, it looks like field is not connected, regulator is on 100%, but voltage is not going up, therefore No ampflow.
Check manual, to read the AST DATA line.
At installation, don\'t forget to follow the manual, and the extra text on the WS500 package from cable.
Have both fuses not installed, when do any work on the wiring, and connectors.
About shunt, I only look to a google picture from the mastervolt shunt, but internally it looks similar as Victon and other brands shunts. A few time a drill 2 extra holes and tap M4 thread in it, and have the shunt wires installed at this M4 bolts. But maybe this effect your warranty on the unit.
I think that\'s better then on the big bolts from the shunt, there can by a small misreading when connected to the big bolts, because extra resistance . And you dont like the sense wires between the shunt and the bug cable lugs.
Ben
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100% SOC progress
With latest config was able to see ACC to Float at 5A. Very close to target. If Ben is out there, I attached an excerpt of the log. Thanks for the suggestion of running the test at full SOC. Just took ten minutes run time. If you happen to see anything odd here, would much appreciate any comments.
For some reason, the float target is 9A while the setting is 5A. I dont think I care too much but wondering if there is some factoring going on.
Thanks
